This week we are trying something new for the podcast – a book club. Jason Cranswick joins us to review and discuss one of our favourite books, ‘Who Moved My Cheese’ by Dr Spencer Johnson.
The book is about two mice and two little men who live in a maze, and you’ve guessed it, someone moves the cheese. It may seem like a simple story, and yes, it is a very easy read, but there are a lot of really important career/life lessons that can be taken away from it.
If you are looking for inspiration for a gift this Christmas, then this might be just the ticket.
Here are the highlights:
{03:22} Leaders Are Readers
{06:55} Which character are you?
{16:25} Any privilege quickly becomes a right.
{19:27} Fear of Loss
{27:24} Winning and Losing
About Symco Training:
Symco Training was founded in 2000 by Simon Bowkett and it was his belief that the business had to offer its clients something different. That difference was clear to Simon from his days in the dealership when he experienced many sales trainers who had all the answers, but were unable, unwilling or both to actually show the delegate how they could be implemented. It remains the ethos of the business today. You see, Symco only employ trainers that are committed to delivering not only in spiring and insightful training, but are equally as happy to demonstrate these skills and techniques with real customers in your own showroom. We believe in order for sales training to be effective and in Simon’s words ‘real world’, it needs to be tried and tested in the only place it matters the showroom floor. There is no room for theory when your goals are for your team to sell more cars, hours or parts and retain more profit. In dealerships around the world the focus applied by many of the sales executives is to try and sell a deal. Symco specialise in getting your teams to focus on selling themselves, the product and then supporting this with the deal.
To find out more visit
www.symcotraining.co.uk
Welcome to the Selling and the Motor Trade Podcast, an association with Symco Training. This is the weekly podcast where we share best practice tips and ideas on how to sell more cars, improve your service department and generally put more profit into your dealership or dealer group. I'm your host, Simon Bowkett. As some of you probably already know me as Skipping, I will start by saying thank you for taking the time to listen to this podcast. Hi and welcome to another episode of Selling and the Motor Trade. Now this is a bit of a Christmas special and it's probably going to be the start of a new series of Selling and the Motor Trays. Today I'm joined with Jason Kremwick from Marabani. He looks after Naught My Group, he looks after ROG and HPL and listens to this. We'll know that we've interviewed Jason probably about, I don't know, six months ago. And part of the interview, you've got to go back and listen to it. It's a great interview. But we're talking about different books that Jason's read. And even in the studio here, I had a lot of the same books there. So I read that book to start with, it was the one-minute manager and that was a good book. And then he said, you've got to listen to this one or read this one. He said, I know from a self-Jason, that definitely changed my life. And after it, Jason said, you know what, Skip, we need to do some sort of a book club. I said, what a great idea. So this is the start of the Selling and the Motor Trade book club. So Jason, welcome aboard again. It is, thank you very much. We sound like a couple of old farts really, don't we talk about book club? Well, it's just one of those things that I started the motor trade when I was 17 years old. And I don't know about you, Jason, but I started washing cars for a living. Okay, school was not the strongest bit for me. Okay, I went in and started washing cars for a living, then started going into the service apartment, parts department, all that stuff. So when people told me to read, I got out of school because I didn't want to do that. Yeah. And a manager gave me a book. He said, you really need this. And it really just turned me on. Now, I know you had a similar experience, didn't you, Joe? Yeah, it did. And again, like you, I wasn't an avid reader. And I joined the industry in 89. So I was kind of 18, 19 years old. So reading wasn't the top of the hit list then. And I must have been out. I got in like you. And we were talking about this before. The one minute manager series is what I started reading. And I guess I wanted to be a good salesperson and a good manager. So those were books that I enjoyed. And I guess over the years of trying to pass those on to other people in a similar situation. But yeah, it's something I must have gotten more into over the years and I'm quite an avid reader now. But yeah, it's good to spend time talking about it. And I think you and I both agreed. We'd love to share some of the things that we've read and some of the stuff we've taken from it. And hey, it won't be for everybody. But for some people, this might be a bit of a thing to get into. Yeah, you know what? There's a phrase written down here. Lebens are readers. And they do. Do you remember? I'll go about this. We should have talked about this before we hit record. But port comings, there's a great American sales trainer. Nine square grid and all of that. That's right. Yeah. So I could with you. Yeah. Yeah. We were doing some work with Honda. This was Honda UK and it was over. You're doing some stuff. And there's one thing they said in his presentation and I spoke with him at the Australian Automotive Dealers Association. Fascinating guy. But he talked about all the big mansions in the state he was in or California or something like that. He was just reading this article. Okay. And he said, all these big mansions, everyone had a library. Yeah. And he thought, wow, someday I want a house that's got a library in it. And then it said in the article, the books were bought before the house was built. Okay. And that's when he went, ah, the books helped get the house book built. And I don't know if it did or didn't, but actually I kind of believe it. I really do. So the books made a big house for Jeff Bezos, didn't they? Yes. Yes. Yeah. And just done very well out of it. I love that one. So listen, we're going to be speaking to a couple of different audiences there. Okay. For me, I'm going to speak into, if you're that business manager, that sales manager, and you want to get your team into some books, you want some ideas for your sales meetings, that's who I'm going to talk at. And I know Jason, you're going to be talking about industry leaders. You're going to be talking to people who do what you do. Okay. All right. Should we talk about the one that we've got in mind? Right. So what do we got to start with? We had to start. And there was so many we had to start on. What are we going for? We've gone for who moved my cheese, which is a personal favorite of mine. Absolutely great book. Who moved my cheese? Dr. Spencer Johnson, written in 1998. And I'm going to say first, I like this book because I'm going to say it now. I call it a toilet book. Now you've got some images in your mind there. I'm really sorry for people listening to this if you eat in breakfast, but it's something that it's quick. It's easy. You can flick through when you've got nothing else to do. And it's short. And I suppose that's why I like it because it was short to start with. Can you give us a bit of an overview of the book? Yeah. I mean, I love the book. As you say, it's a really quick read. If you don't even want to read it, you can watch it on YouTube in about 10, 15 minutes. But it's about two little mice and two little men that live in a maze and someone nicks the cheats. And effectively, kind of follows the story of who goes out to find new cheese and who just wants to moan about the fact that cheese has been moved. And I think there's some really interesting metaphors in there that we can really relate to. But it's one that I first discovered probably about in 2005, I was doing a role coaching heads of businesses. And the role was all about taking people through a change process and getting people to face up to the fact that things were going to be different. And that's where I first discovered it. And I think this story is a really strong one. And it really forces you to think about whether you see yourself in there, whether you're one of the little mice or one of the little men, whether someone that can go off and find new cheese or whether you're going to just sit in the cheese station, see as they call it and moan about the fact that cheese has gone. I just think the motor trailer, my goodness me, don't we need this? It's all about change. I mean, we've both been in the motor trade for a long time. And have you ever seen the change that we've gone through over the last four years in the motor trade? It's incredible. And it's funny, isn't it? Because there is a huge amount of change. And change brings with it uncertainty and anxiety for some areas. And I think we all suffer those at times. It also brings excitement and it becomes quite exhilarating. And even when change is force upon us, our attitude to how we embrace it is what's important. And that's why I was keen to talk about this one, because that's what this story tells. We were talking before Skip about who we were and there's these two little mice and two little men. And I think it's funny enough, we came up with two different answers. Who did you think you were? Well, let's, people haven't read the book yet. We want you to go and read this book. That's the goal of this. Go and listen to it on the way home in your car. You know, order to build something like that. But there's, here's the four different people and we'll, actually, some of the listeners will probably know who I am. Okay. But first you have the two mice. There's sniff and this guy. So what happens is they go into this maze and they try and find some cheese. So what the two mice do is they just run into all these little dead ends and up these blind alleys. And they keep on running around until they find the cheese. But sniff is a bit smarter because he sniffs around the mindless needs. Scurry. He just runs around and bounces around everywhere until he falls over it almost. Then you've got these two little people. Now, if you've not read the book yet, this might not make too much sense. Okay. But read the book and these two guys are people. They're very intelligent, maybe too intelligent for their own good, but they're mouse sized and you've got a guy called whore first. Okay. So, and then there's him. Now these guys, they go into the mice maze and they find this cheese to start with. Cheese though. I suppose Jason, we need to say that's a bit of metaphor for life, isn't it? Okay. Cheese is what is cheese to you? I suppose cheese is, you know, the thing, isn't it? It's either the money or it's the recognition or it's the, you know, the feel good. It could be, you know, it could be the big house or it could be the fast car, but effective. It's the thing that they cherished, but also probably felt they deserved. And actually ironically, it's the thing they took for granted. But also it's not just that. I think it's also someone in your organization. It might be a line manager saying, hey, the cheese is, I want that next position. Where is that position? I want that position. And some of them think that position, it's just given and granted. I'm not to admit your people specifically now. It happens, doesn't it? So you've got him and four. How would you describe him and four? Well, you know, they look, they look very similar. They look like a, you know, a couple of buddies, you know, dressed quite similar. But they certainly were different thinkers. So you had, you had him who was probably the stick in the mud. He was the guy that really didn't like the fact. He really took objection to the fact that she's a gun. And then he had a whore who kind of looked the same, but actually started to break out and start to think differently. And he was a bit more of a risk-taker. And actually as the story goes on, you know, all was the one who fronted up to the situation where it's quite frankly, him just, you know, he just moaned about it. He was just bitter that the cheese had gone. And quite frankly, he was going to wait for that cheese to be brought back to him. I love the bit because I've almost heard this word for word in cardial ships around the world. Once the cheese ran out, they had to go and find new cheese. That's the moral of this whole story. Okay. However, when the cheese ran out, it was actually him who's turned around and said, where's my cheese? Where's my cheese? He starts telling, where's my cheese? This is not fair. This is not fair. And it was everyone else's fault, not his. Don't you hear that all the time? Yeah, you do. You do. And you can understand it. I think it is super hard for things. And when it changes and when something happens that they feel is outside of their control, then they don't like it. And I think that's the big difference though between the two little guys. Hall, he kind of fronted up and he went off and started putting in countermeasures and controls to make sure that he could not only find new cheese, but when he found it, make sure that it didn't go missing again. And it's quite funny how you, when you read through the story and say, the whole point of this is to get people interested and go and pick up the book and maybe reading it. But certainly if we could be a bit more whole like, if I can use that term, then yes. Here's the hero. Here's the hero in this. Yeah. Yeah. And Jason, by fear, I am scurry. And it's when I read it, I'd like to say, no, I'm not, no, I'm not. But really I am. And what I mean by that is I feel myself as even in sub-code training, we've gone for 23 years, there's been so much change there. I found I scurry around, scurry around, scurry around, scurry around. I mean, when COVID happened, okay, we couldn't go into businesses. Our business stopped overnight. We still had mouths to feed. Okay. So we had competitors went into the sulking, this not fair. Why did the government do this to us? And I just went scurry, what do we do? What do we do? Podcasts. Let's do that. And but I should have been more snip. I fear. I should have put a bit more planning into it. I should have. I see my limitations there. I just run around into them. Let's try this. Let's try that. Let's try this. And I don't slow down enough. I think that's who I am in the story. What about yourself? Well, I definitely don't want to be him. No, because he was the guy that just sat and evaporated in the end. I'd like to think I'm all. I'd like to think that I'm prepared to go and deal with change and try new things and take a bit of risk and get out there in the maze and go and find new cheese. That's the one that I guess I related to. I remember when I first read the book, you know, like you say, I saw the sniff and scurries. It's being the ones that were going off and sort of breaking out from the establishment. And yeah, it's interesting. You do see yourself in it and I must admit, whereas maybe 15 years ago, maybe I'd have seen myself as a sniff or a scurry. You know, now I kind of look at it thinking, well, I want to be the, you know, the little man who went out and found new cheese and made sure cheese didn't move again. And certainly don't want to be type cast into being the guy that wasn't better guy and try new things. Jason, for me, he's definitely the hero because he goes through all of the emotions. Right. The beginning is this is not fair. Why have they moved it? For me, the other thing is him tried his hardest to bring his mate down. You don't want to go look for new cheese. Just sit here and wait here. I'll bring it back to it. It's almost the entitlement. Would that be the right phrase that that ham had? Yeah, I think so. I think, so that's my dog rolling around on the floor if you'd miss something. Clearly like the sort of book club. Yeah, he was quite happy to bring his mate down. He had a bit most comfortable surrounding himself by other people like him that we're going to complain about how everything's not fair. But yeah, it's one to watch for. Do you know what I thought was also interesting, Skip? I'm going to watch this again. I made some notes about what I was prompted to think about. Or he really challenged the state as quote. He was prepared to think differently. Yeah. Actually, and I know it sounds a bit, a bit, you know, gooey-roo-ish, but he kind of manifested. Oh, no, he definitely did. Yeah, and I know it's a big topic at the minute, but you know, he actually, he's positive. He can visualize it. He can visualize the cheats. He can visualize the so many different types of cheats. What you choose could be. Yeah. Yeah, that change could be better. I'm going to focus on him a bit because if you listen to this, you're a hen. Okay. We see lots of hems. Okay. And they're good, good guys. They are, they're not bad people at all. They just want that security in life. And when it changes, they go through more pain. But it reminds me that there's a phrase. Any privilege, it comes of right very quickly in the motor train. And I'm going to tell you a story about that Swan's way organization. Peter Smife, I know he listens to the podcast and the guest on it and listen to it all the time. I'm sure he won't mind me saying this, but in one of these businesses, it was Stafford Audi. There's a guy turned up 21 years old and he was a carpenter or electrician, something like that. And they gave him a brand new registered tax Audi A1. Now, of course, Jason, he come out of an old clap out of the estu or something like that. And he loved this thing. He tells the story where he washed the car himself. We don't wash cars. Those over them. Right. So, he went and took grandma to the garden centre. On his first weekend, he went back to his mates on the weekend for football training, something like that, and left the keys to the Audi there so they could all see his lovely new Audi. How long did he like that car for? Actually, he liked that car for about a week and a half. But the other trainee, they put them in an A3. Someone else was driving a Q5. Someone else says in something else. How long did he like that pop in your pack? Pizza share. OK, Audi A1. It's a week and a half because when he first got it, OK, it was great because he compared it to where he's coming from. And it was that privilege he's got it. OK. And then he was winching and bitching about everyone else who got something else. But if you took the A1 off it then, what would happen? And it's kind of like that change is good because his first change was great for him. I'll tell you what, if they took it off it, it'd go the other way. Yeah. I always... You've drawn to me to think about something. I remember it's not relevant to this book, but it's that whole piece around the fear of loss actually is more powerful than the attraction of gain. And that's something that's interested in our industry. That we do live in a world where people are... We're trying to find ways of motivating and so on. Again, this could lead into another area of where we go looking. But the whole behavioural science piece, and as you say, the things that become expected norms and the stuff that doesn't have the desired outcome in terms of motivation that was expected, it's quite surprising. And I think these are things that if you are a team manager, if you're a new manager or you've got a team that you're trying to find new ways of motivating, then be prepared to try new things and listen to people that have got different ideas. But also, you've got to understand the true science behind individuals' behaviours. I think that's something we don't spend enough time on as an industry. I think fear of losses are huge, manoeuvrable for customers. Okay. Buying a car for fear of someone else buys it, salespeople. But also, I think the response of that in this book. Okay. And I mean the fear, what was holding... My hero is horrible. What holding back to the start is the fear of going out there and what if he didn't find cheese and what if he was like, he's went through it once before and he's getting older now, I don't know if I can do it. But what I actually got in there was the fear of, well, if he doesn't do it, actually, we're never going to have cheese ever again. So, a bit of fear is good and a great friend of both of ours, Gareth, Tim, okay. I said to him on the podcast and a great book. He's got another book coming out. We'll need to, at some point we need to talk about his book on this book. He turned around and he said, it was a fear of going back to his old life. The fear of telling everyone that, actually, I'm no longer going to be a rock commander now, was probably a bigger motivator for him than the pleasure of getting to where he was. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you know what? One that we should put on the list, Skip, and I know you and I are kind of talking about where we go next with some of these. A definite read is the Chimp Paradox. Oh. Chimp Paradox, we've got to go and look at that. That's a fascinating one. If we're going to try and explore some of these topics of why people do things and imposters in your homes and stuff like that, then Chimp Paradox has got to go on to our reading list. I want to bring that up sooner rather than later, I think. That's absolutely brewing. Can I ask you a question? This is a tough one though. You go into a new organization, not your organization. Let's say you acquire a new business or whatever. If that happens, you're going to have, Hem's going to be there. There'll be some Stiffs and Scurries. You've got to guide them in the right way. You go have some Hem's. How do we make Hem's forwards? How do we, what have you done in the past? How do we show them the mirror that changes not always bad? Yeah. I think a lot of it comes back to create a safe environment. The maze can't feel like it's a scary maze. It's got to feel like it's somewhere safe for people to go into. I think there's a bit in here about almost being able to highlight the risk of cheese being moved and get people sensitive to the fact that we need to be out there looking for the signs of cheese being taken away. I think there's that whole piece about fail fast and learn. That sounds a bit of a cliche, but create an environment. Prepare to go and try something without the fear of it being painful or terminal. But as long as we learn from it, I think those are things. That's not a cliche. That's so important. To me, organisations people don't want to try something, but feel the ball looking they're going to get. That's not a cliche, that's a big one. I know you do that in your organisation. Come on, let's try it. It's also been prepared to go off and pivot to use that word. We're trying this, not working. What are we going to try next? Because not trying anything isn't an option. It's that almost intention to find reason to pivot rather than making change a thing that everybody just wants to avoid and resist. There's no set formula, but I think it's ironic that a lot of these messages are in the Who Moved My Cheese story. I scribble down this. I don't know if it's directly in there or not. I don't know if I... Because when you read these books, doesn't your mind go off into lots of different areas and you think of your life and people you're working with. I scribble down here, what would you do if you knew you couldn't bail at it? I don't know if I directly go up from the book, but actually that's why I scribble down on one of my notes here. I think that's one of the things or the sentiment of one of the things that Hor writes on the wall. I think it's... I don't know if you wrote it on the wall. I can't remember it exactly, but it's something like that, wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah. I think if you knew that you could not fail, then you would probably take what you regard to be even bigger risk or your attitude towards trying things would be much more open-minded because you've got that reality of not being able to fail. In reality, that's not a real situation. There's always going to be risk of downsides, but I actually think if you could dare to think, well, what would I do if I knew I couldn't fail? Then you'd probably come up with some new ideas. Yeah, because I love it, but I'm worried that people go off on a loose cannon sometimes. I want to say people, I'm talking about me. I know I've gone off on a loose cannon. I've got 60 grand worth of development that I did back in 2006 on a digital program which failed because I went off like a loose cannon. Yeah, I do worry about that sometimes, but I get the sentiment. If I didn't try though, I already did fail, I suppose. Yeah. Do you know what? This has reminded me of Don't front-end office talking at a franchise dealer conference the day, I'm just talking about change and the plan. The reality is we sit there as individuals assuming that you look over there at someone else who's gone, aren't they lucky? It's just been a straight line for them. They've gone from here to here and I want some of that. The reality is it never is a straight line. The reality is it's valleys and troughs and pinks and snow-capped mountains and bog-filled water-filled bogs that you have to get through to get to the end. That's the reality. It's that journey and I think the thing is you learn at each of those points. I think you've got to put yourself out there and you've got to try things. I think that's the great thing about our industry though is all those opportunities are out there. It is never a straight line. If the nearest thing to a straight line probably is when we've come out of things like COVID and suddenly the market takes us, that's a straight line. The reality is that's unusual and we're now in that peaks and troughs, mountains and valleys situation. I come back to the point at the right and the beginning is as individuals we've got to have the right skill set, tool set and mindset to see our way through that journey and be prepared to embrace it. We sound like it's even angelically, mate. It is, but you know what? There's so many people who have moditated. We've been saying it all the time. Since COVID-19, there were lots of people like, look at it. I'm heroes. Look what I've achieved. Look what I've done. Sean Kelly, a great fan of the podcast. It's all the time. Listen, when we've done really, really well, we've always patted ourselves on the back. When it's shit, it's always the market's fault. It can't be both. It can't be both. Do you know what? I saw there was a great thing on LinkedIn the other day that I saw and I think I've read this right. It says when you're winning, you're not as good as you think you are. When you're losing, you're not as bad as you think you are. I love that. And I think there's a lot of true sentiment in that one. So true. Listen, this sounds like I'm in therapy now here. But I'm definitely scurry and I shouldn't be. I should be more. I should be more whore. I should plan more. I should sniff more. I should start sniffing when the cheese is old and look for new cheese before the cheese runs out and all that sort of stuff there. But here's the other thing. I spoke at the Australian Automotive Dealers Association, Patrick Tessier. I was out there with Paul Cummings was speaking. It was Grant Congone, another year, David Martin. I love speaking at conference. And Patrick really does a great, great conference out there. And Blomone Trumpadise voted the best speaker. I was pat myself on the back. I was loving it. But then I had the reviews. And one guy said, okay, it was there. Okay. What do you say? Wasn't that average? You said something like that. That average perdidal before. Nothing really new. And of course, what did I focus on? Yeah. I focused on that guy. So much so, Jason. I'm embarrassed to tell you. I had to phone the guy. I'm going to go, what's wrong? That was one of the best things. Okay. And he said, it's crazy. He said, it was not what I was looking for. What were you looking for? I'm a business manager. He didn't do anything on finance. Well, it wasn't fucking about finance. Okay. But it's just because I was so focused on that when you're bad, you're not as bad as you think. Yeah. But why do we as humans focus on the bad? Is that just me? I don't know. I'm in therapy now, Jason. Well, I don't know. I'm no therapist, mate. I can tell you that you're sure. But you've teed up nicely there to the whole Chimp paradox. I think this is one that people should spend time thinking about because at the end of the day, there's a little Chimp up here in our brain that we can't control. We can't stop it doing the thing that it does. But what we can do is we can read the signs. And maybe that's the thing. Maybe that was your Chimp that was reacting then. And maybe if you'd have seen the signs, what you'd have done is put in a bit of a strategy to maybe pause, breathe. Maybe tell us some advice before you made that call in front of the guy. That is it. We were going to ask people what they want next from seven habits, a highly successful people, the five AM drive to survive. But I tell you what, the Chimp paradox, I think that's we need to get into that. Now, Kenneth Blanchard is a man that wrote One Minute Manager. He wrote this in conjunction with Dr. Spencer Johnson. So that's where this people want to get into reading. They've got to look at that series, I think. So we're going to definitely talk about the One Minute Manager on another time because there's too many valuable things to leave out. But there's something I learned this morning. This book was our first published in 1998. Since then, it's been rewritten 10 times. Oh gosh. And I just love that. So if you think about this, Dr. Spencer Johnson didn't just write it and leave his cheese and let it go off there to get stale and be not right. He's up there. Now, the story's still the same. Let's say we've rewritten this, been 10 different times. He's adjusted things. And other things like him. So if you go and read this from yours and my old copy, it was an old one there. I did some research on the insert when they said 10 times. So if you listen to the audio book, apparently that's the latest one. OK. But you think about that 10 times in about a relatively short period of time, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. That's life, isn't it? You know, changes. He practices what he bridges. So, Jason, I love this. Good therapy as well. OK. And I'm going to say the chip paradox. I'm going to keep you can keep being my therapist. OK. And see what I'm wrong. Do you send him the checks and skip it? No problem. No problem. But what I've got from that is that book is relevant today is one of the matter. I think it's so relevant in the motor trade now. I think I just personally want to urge everyone to listen. Go to Amazon, get a copy of the book. OK. Give it to people in your businesses. Jason, I hope you don't mind me to invent your business. By understanding you're going to give some of your senior managers this book. Yeah. Yes. I'm a bit like Amazon. I keep sort of dishing out books. And I think that this is one that we use. And I know Steve is using it now with the managers and sales teams around what's happening in the business. We've used a few recently. A couple of others that we've used is good to great. And I think we'd all like to emulate the story of good to great. There's another one in the series that I've issued out as well. It's better than you told me this one. And not good to great. It's the next one. Other might you fall? No. Other might you fall? Do you know what, though, Skipie? And I've seen this a lot in different businesses. Look, you know, just, just, and I always caveat it, just because I've given, you know, the teams of the books, and I'm not expecting them to sit there and avidly read them, I'd love to think that it helps them think that they can think differently and that we're as a business. We're wanting to encourage, you know, a strength of mindset around, you know, what we go through as an industry. But like we said, right at the beginning, look, even if you're not an avid reader, then, you know, a lot of this stuff now, you should say audio, but we're all in the cut. So, you know, you can jump in a podcast like this, or you can get an audio book and you can absorb it that way. A lot of it, you know, and who moved my cheese is available on YouTube. You can sit there and watch it in 10 or 15 minutes in a sales meeting. And you know, that's great, you know, because you get other people to look and say who they are, if they're Sniff Scurry, or you know, it's a really good tool like that. Well put a link to that YouTube there. That's it is 10, 15 minutes. You've watched in a sales meeting. It just sums it up quickly to the point, brilliant, absolutely brilliant. Yeah. But, you know, I just, we spoke with us many months ago that, you know, there's so much that we've enjoyed from taking different references, then, you know, it's great to talk about. And we've what's on for half an hour or more about a book there. You could have finished reading in half the time. I go say whenever I talk about any management, whenever we do any management training, Jason, I'm always training myself more than anyone in the room because I just see myself making these same mistakes so often they're thinking, why have I done that? Why did I react this way? Why do I react that way? So it's, I hope this doesn't come across like where the experts here, because I know this person definitely is not. But if you can get something from it, that's what it's all about. Now listen, my last takeaway, Jason, I'm going to give you my last takeaway from the book and I'm going to ask you all last takeaway. What I really liked at the end of it, my hero, okay, or who did change, he soaked a bit to start with, his friend tried to bring him down there, okay, he went back to try and get his friend, his friend wasn't interested at all, okay, and sometimes you go leave people where they are and let them make their own decisions. What I really like though is when he found the cheese, the huge pile of cheese, the fresh new cheese, he still had his shoes hung around his neck. If he wasn't going to go into complacency again, that was one of my favorite takeaways at the end. For yourself, sir? Well, very much the same. Don't fall asleep at the switch. That's why I wrote down here. Yeah, so true. So true. Listen, I really love this, okay, and listen, we hope you've loved this as well. This is coming out just before Christmas. So if you listen to this while you're walking off your Christmas dinner, okay, I hope it has made your journey a little bit more enjoyable. Thanks, I believe. And Jason, thank you so much, this is my speaker again soon, yeah? That just leaves me to say that all details of this episode and other episodes on the selling in the motor trade can be found on our website simcotraining.co.uk. Go there to get a copy of our book, Words That Sell Cars. Go there to sign up to a free trial of our sales fitness online sales training program. Easiest way to get hold of me is Simon Bowkett, food linked in. Thank you.
